Some people just don't get it
I did a search on blogger today to see how many other blogs there are with the same theme as mine. I stumbled across a blog entry by a gal who has several gay friends about 4 "gay Mormons." She posted links to the blogs of those 4 self-confessed "gay Mormons," and I couldn't help but think that some of them have missed some crucial points.
For me, it is just this simple: we have been told that we "shall live by every word which proceedeth forth out of the mouth of God," and that we should take the words of the prophet as if they came from God's own mouth. This makes issues of right and wrong very simple. The Proclamation on the Family makes it very clear how we should live, including those of us with SSA. Now, if you don't believe that the LDS church is led by a prophet, then that's different, and if you call yourself Mormon and don't believe that, then you need to do some soul searching. I do believe this principle, and know that following him is the right thing to do. When people talk about deprogramming in those posts, I don't see how they can believe that the church is led by a prophet. Some of them say that they believe in the church, but not it's stand on homosexuality. IT DOESN'T WORK THAT WAY...IT'S ALL OR NOTHING (imho). It's not a smorgasbord where you can pick and choose.
One of the 4 mentioned above talked about going on gay dates, and had talked himself into believing that he could be an upright member of the church. It really appeared that he couldn't see that this was one of the first steps in walking away from the church.
Part of having SSA (at least for me, and I know for quite a few others as well) is about not having had adequate male bonding in my life, about the unfulfilled need for healthy male relationships. I can't say that I haven't thought about what it would be like to indulge my desires and have a relationship with a man. Since I don't know very well how to build normal healthy male relationships, it's easy to imagine something else. But, I value what I get from being a member of the LDS church more. That is why I have stayed the course, served a mission, found a wonderful woman I could love and marry in the temple. That is why I have tried to fulfill the callings I have had honorably and keep my desires in check, and to find healthy appropriate ways to meet those needs.
Maybe I just value my membership in the church more than they do. I certainly value it more than the short lived pleasure I would get from indulging my desires. Maybe it really is as simple as "they just don't get it."
posted by LDSwithSSA at Friday, January 13, 2006
17 Comments:
I agree
3:16 PM
IT'S ALL OR NOTHING
Something that has brought a lot of peace in my life is the knowledge that there is always a 3rd option.
1:28 PM
There are always options, and we are free to choose, but my point here is that either the prophet speaks for God, or he doesn't. If he does, it's all true, ALL of it. If not, then nothing he says has any authority. I believe firmly enough in what he says to sacrifice the option of acting on my feelings in exchange for greater rewards and blessings.
11:54 PM
I guess the third option would be the one I'm taking right now which is to work on resolving my issues and creating in myself the man I desire and not stressing too much about getting married until I feel ready and know I can do it without bringing a whole load of baggage.
1:09 PM
I think you're right, if you believe in the church you should believe all the teachings of the church. I happen to believe that being gay is not a choice I made, therefore, I don't believe in the church anymore since the church teaches that being gay is a choice you make.
11:00 AM
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11:00 AM
Dave- you are wrong. The church doesn't teach that being "gay" is a choice you make. The church teaches that it doesn't know whether we are born that way or whether it is something affected by events in our lives (Elder Oaks and President Hinckley have both said that). Either way, the church still does not blame us for feeling this way. They acknowledge that it is something that came into our lives without us planning for it to happen.
The choice is whether or not to have sex with men. That is 100% a choice we make. The church tells us not to do it. That's what you don't want to hear and that's why you don't agree with the church.
3:46 PM
Dave- you are wrong. The church doesn't teach that being "gay" is a choice you make. The church teaches that it doesn't know whether we are born that way or whether it is something affected by events in our lives (Elder Oaks and President Hinckley have both said that). Either way, the church still does not blame us for feeling this way. They acknowledge that it is something that came into our lives without us planning for it to happen.
The choice is whether or not to have sex with men. That is 100% a choice we make. The church tells us not to do it. That's what you don't want to hear and that's why you don't agree with the church.
I see what you're saying. Yet, you fail to see that the the church doctrine seems to apply to everyone but Gay people. Think about this: the supposedly no longer encourages gay men to get married. So, we as gay men will never ever ever in our lives, mortal or post-mortal be able to reach our 'full' potential... of becoming "like" god. We'll never be married in the temple, we'll never do any of that stuff...How is THAT fair? Even if we're celibate, evein if we live by all of the rules... We cant even GO to the highest kingdom if we wanted to...because we're not married. This all points to two possibilities: change is on the way in Mormon doctrine, because surely someone other than myself sees this. Or maybe the church ISNT 100 percent true, at least on this issue, and people should be less afraid of a God who did create them this way, and who is supposed to love all of his children equally.
4:37 PM
dc...did you read the post?? Either he speaks for God, and his word is final, or he doesn't, and it doesn't matter what he says! I happen to believe the first position.
10:01 PM
dc...did you read the post?? Either he speaks for God, and his word is final, or he doesn't, and it doesn't matter what he says! I happen to believe the first position.
Thats great and wonderful for you...but as far as I can tell you arent gay and you dont know what its like. Besides, you didnt address one thing that I said. I have legitimate questions and I want legitimate answers. "Believe it because he says so..." is not a good enough answer. The church needs to be able to explain to me how Gay men who are celibate and who never get married in the temple fit into the plan of salvation. The truth is, they dont, really...and thats what you dont want to hear. "Straight" people have the opportunity to marry other Mormons in the temple. Gay men don't...
8:37 PM
The church needs to be able to explain to me...
Don't you think that's a bit bold??
and you missed my point.
3:44 PM
I don't feel the desire to judge anyone right now, but I will post this DIRECT quote from the Proclamation on the Family. I took a gay friend of mine to Temple Square last summer and he caught this phrasing that I had never noticed before.
"Happiness in family life is most likely to be achieved when founded upon the teachings of the Lord Jesus Christ."
Interesting wording I thought.
Nobody knows everything, even President Hinckley stated on Larry King Live! that he is "not and expert" on gay issues and the he doesn't understand homosexuality. Disheartening news for those Mormons that are facing it.
I believe in living the life that brings peace to your heart and how about we all try a little harder not to take the job of Judge out of Gods hands and into our own.
1:19 PM
What a self-righteous, arrogant post. And, typical of Mormon culture, "LDS with SSA" makes himself out to be more "righteous" than others. I've never understood that among Mormons....
1:10 AM
I could take this post until this:
Maybe I just value my membership in the church more than they do. I certainly value it more than the short lived pleasure I would get from indulging my desires. Maybe it really is as simple as "they just don't get it."
I'm a married gay Mormon. I'm in the process of building a different life for myself. Your self righteousness is a reminder that I'm now finally on the path that is best for me. And it's not a path that will allow me "indulge my desires" -- it's a path of greater integrity and authenticity than the one I have been on to this point in my life.
So who doesn't get it? It's not people who don't make the same choices as you. It's people who assume that the choices they are making are the right choices for everyone else.
8:55 AM
You'll know that once you've died. Do you want to wait until then?
Glad to see it's not just the gay Mormons who are being smug and self righteous.
8:56 AM
I'm so far behind in this, maybe nobody will ever read my comments anyway. But I just had to point out to dctwisted that there are LOTS of people who regrettably live their whole life without finding a companion, without having sex. And maybe they do it because they are trying to do the best they can to live the gospel. Take single sisters who just never find a companion and in the culture of the church don't feel comfortable being aggressive to find one. We (gay mormon guys) aren't the only one's working through it.
3:34 AM
This quote sheds some light about the eternal marriage issue:
"Through the merciful plan of our Father in Heaven, persons who desire to do what is right but through no fault of their own are unable to have an eternal marriage in mortal life will have an opportunity to qualify for eternal life in a period following mortality, if they keep the commandments of God and are true to their baptismal and other covenants." --(Dallin H. Oaks, “Same-Gender Attraction,” Ensign, Oct. 1995)
2:01 PM
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